Inspired or ripped?

[Kim]

It's a lot harder to be creative and 'do your own thing' that's why many people take the low road and rip other's work then spend all their energy trying to defend their actions. Seen it all too often for far too long. Tends to make one tired.

Never a truer word spoken John ... (or written in this case ) as someone who has had entire skins, code, graphics ripped and then refactored slightly and sold as someone else's work.... I can tell you it is beyond tiring or tiresome.

 

[Shelley]

I designed and coded the original one for vB 3 and eventually ported it and improved it for vB 4.

I have no problem with this Inspired version at all, other that remotely use a similar color scheme, Karev skin is completely different and original.

Looks good Karev, keep up the good work

Nicely put Miko.

Everybody get's inspired by others works, It's when you start copying (in this case style) if the works were exactly the same. Same hex values used in gradients, and other areas. If the hex values differ and so do the graphics then it's not copying but induced inspiration.

I've seen flat out copying by some top IPB stylers (i won't name them) and I can say that is copying with the same hex values/graphics/design template layouts/structure used which is next to impossible to duplicate unless you get the eye-dropper tool and flat out copy the gradient or other elements that make up styles. Heck, even I get inspiration by people starting out in styling, graphics because they tend to do things differently and go wild in their creations.

 

[TheBoss]

Looks like we have a lot of varied thoughts and ideas on what is the correct path....

I have been a webmaster for more years than I care to remember , a web host provider for not quite as long but a long, long time and I have seen this type of thread on a thousand boards or more and the only way this is going to end eventually is with someone getting banned and the thread being closed without any positive outcome. As there will FOREVER be 2 trains of thought , neither of which is right or wrong. FACT.

If I were a sceptic and some will say I am ( who know me better in other places ) I could go through every skin released so far on here and say this is a copy of that or that looks identical to someone elses skin from a couple of years ago on different software.
Another popular one here looks remarkably like a basic Wordpress skin with varying colours , but knowone has mentioned that yet as being a ripp.
Why..?? Because people take them for what they are which is ; a free offering of someones work , time they spent doing something for anyones benefit without charge.. FREE GRATIS.

If CyberAP had release the skin and was asking for a fee then I could possibly see some logic in the owner of ForumThemes being upset and asking CyberAPP for some clarification. But all I see here is other skin developers claiming foul or preaching from a soap box...

I must end this now before I get really carried away , besides which I gotta go find yellow pages and look up the copyright office as I am going to claim copyright on the RAINBOW..

Regards...

 

[Kim]

As there will FOREVER be 2 trains of thought

Yes ...Right or Wrong.

Legally, morally, creatively, direct copying is Wrong.

It's pretty simple


To say it is OK because someone doesn't charge a fee is to miss the point of intellectual property completely.

A creative work was made by X

X automatically (without having to rush to any copyright office) owns the Intellectual Property rights to that work.

Y cannot knowingly and without permission, reproduce it without automatically violating X's Intellectual Property rights.

Whether there is a Fee involved or not is a misnomer, and is in fact if anything making the matter worse... if the original was a Work for which X charges and issues a license for use thereof, then no only is Y violating X's Intellectual Property Rights, he/she is also potentially robbing them of income.

 

[Kim]

Nicely put Miko.

Everybody get's inspired by others works, It's when you start copying (in this case style) if the works were exactly the same. Same hex values used in gradients, and other areas. If the hex values differ and so do the graphics then it's not copying but induced inspiration.

I've seen flat out copying by some top IPB stylers (i won't name them) and I can say that is copying with the same hex values/graphics/design template layouts/structure used which is next to impossible to duplicate unless you get the eye-dropper tool and flat out copy the gradient or other elements that make up styles. Heck, even I get inspiration by people starting out in styling, graphics because they tend to do things differently and go wild in their creations.

Couldn't agree more Shelley, Inspiration is one thing... we all get inspired by great design we see all around us all the time....

but...deliberately copying a design is a completely different thing.

 

[Miko]

Sorry but colors have no copyright

You are wrong!

Example: T-Mobile (Deutsche Telekom) have trademarked the color magenta and have been actively suing anyone from using it!
Bollocks but true

A interesting article on the matter: http://sixrevisions.com/web_design/color-the-next-limited-resource/

 

[John]

If this was just some simple hobby thing I doubt you'd see such strong opinions but when you start screwing with someone's livelihood you're going to get pushback. I can't tell you how pissed I get when I have worked my tail off (and invested my own money) to produce something that will help pay my bills and put food on my kid's table and some asshat with a warped sense of entitlement comes along and rips me off because "sharing" is the internet way.

 

[Elizabeth]

There is a method in scrapping called scraplifting and it's perfectly legal. First, the definition:

Scraplifting Etiquette

Scraplifting (skrap-lift-ing) – The act of copying ideas and designs from another person’s scrapbook page to use in your own pages. Designs or ideas can be copied in whole or in part and is largely subjective.

And then the rules:

Personal Use – If you’re using a scraplifted layout purely for your own personal use, for your friends and family to enjoy in your albums…make every single page a scraplift if you want to! That’s perfectly acceptable, completely encouraged, and flattering to all those people whose work inspired you.

Give Credit Where Credit is Due – If you’re going to be posting the layout online or sharing it with any online group, be sure to give proper credit to the original artist. Linking to the original layout that you copied from is a great way to do this. You can also give a magazine or book issue and page number for layouts copied from magazines and idea books. Another option is to include the original layout image as part of your layout image, so the two layouts can be seen side by side. If you don’t remember who you copied from, but know that it was copied, be sure to mention “This is a scraplift, but I don’t remember who did the original. If anyone knows, I’d love to give credit.” Many times the original artist will pipe up and be thrilled that you decided to use her ideas. Then you can give proper credit.

Don’t Submit It – If you have copied a layout or a design, especially in full, do not submit the idea as your own to a magazine, idea book, layout contest etc. for any type of publication or compensation.

Among scrappers this has been quoted:

The consensus seemed to be that if at least 1/3 of the page was changed, it could be considered original and could be submitted to a magazine or contest for publication and personal gain. Basic sketches, unique techniques and exact creative design seemed to be the most “taboo” to lift and submit.

 

[Kim]

There is a method in scrapping called scraplifting and it's perfectly legal. First, the definition:

Scraplifting Etiquette

That is an agreed Etiquette Liz, nothing to do with legality actually it would be perfectly possible for a scrapbooker who did a 100% totally original design to claim copyright on it.

It might be OK in scrapbooking, largely because you have all agreed to it.. or it is so widespread it can't be stopped, but it's not in almost every other creative endeavour.

 

[Elizabeth]

That is an agreed Etiquette Liz, nothing to do with legality actually it would be perfectly possible for a scrapbooker who did a 100% totally original design to claim copyright on it.

It might be OK in scrapbooking, largely because you have all agreed to it.. or it is so widespread it can't be stopped, but it's not in almost every other creative endeavour.

Part of it is HOW we scraplift. The personal use, give credit, and how much before we are even allowed to consider it our own.

With that said, even I realize there is only so many ways to make a button, a header, a bar, etc. There are only so many colors a forum uses, etc. We are limited in some things, it's how we put them together that make them different.

 

[Miko]

I'm well aware that is perfectly legal to do so.
The legal way is not always the right way to do things.

Do so at your own risk... be well prepared for the Witch Hunt, designers and coders are not of the forgiving kind.

The community is way to small to get away with it unnoticed I'm afraid.

Personally after the copyrighted images were removed I didn't have a problem with the skin,



but since the OP is going in circles trying to justify his actions he is really pissing me off.

As John very well said, some of us are making a living out of designing and it's not a hobby, people "ripping", "Scraplifting" (call it whatever you like) can potentially affect our income.

What if William from ForumTheme was planning on releasing the very same skin for XenForo and expand his business to a new forum platform?
Don't you think he has the right to be somewhat pissed that a heavily inspired version of his design was already released before is official version.

Who is going to pay for the official version when you can get the copy for free?

Time to go and relax and think about happy thoughts

 

[Elizabeth]

I'm well aware that is perfectly legal to do so.
The legal way is not always the right way to do things.
Do so at your own risk... be well prepared for the Which Hunt, designers and coders are not of the forgiving kind.
The community is way to small to get away with it unnoticed I'm afraid.

Personally after the copyrighted images were removed I didn't have a problem with the skin, but since the OP is going in circle trying to justify his action he is really pissing me off.

As John very well said, some of us are making a living out of designing and it's not a hobby, people "ripping", "Scraplifting" (called it whatever you like) can potentially affect our income.

What if William from ForumTheme was planing of releasing the very same skin tfor XenForo and expand his business to a new forum platform?
Don't you think he has the right to be somewhat pissed that a heavily inspired version of his design was already released before is official version.

Who is going to pay for the official version when you can get the copy for free?

Time to go and relax and think about happy thoughts

Miko, we've gone around and around on this as well...why pay for something when you can get it for free? And believe me the scrapping business has a BOATLOAD of freebies. Trouble is, you get what you pay for. And then we have the pirate community who rip us off, passing off our work as their own. Rebranding it.

After three years, I've even closed up shop for now as a result of this...the market is gluted with freebies. Thankfully, *I* don't depend on the income but many do. In fact three shops closed this week.

 

[CyberAP]

I'm well aware that is perfectly legal to do so.
The legal way is not always the right way to do things.

Do so at your own risk... be well prepared for the Witch Hunt, designers and coders are not of the forgiving kind.

The community is way to small to get away with it unnoticed I'm afraid.

Personally after the copyrighted images were removed I didn't have a problem with the skin,

View attachment 5483

but since the OP is going in circles trying to justify his actions he is really pissing me off.

As John very well said, some of us are making a living out of designing and it's not a hobby, people "ripping", "Scraplifting" (call it whatever you like) can potentially affect our income.

What if William from ForumTheme was planning on releasing the very same skin for XenForo and expand his business to a new forum platform?
Don't you think he has the right to be somewhat pissed that a heavily inspired version of his design was already released before is official version.

Who is going to pay for the official version when you can get the copy for free?

Time to go and relax and think about happy thoughts

As I said these images were copyed that's why the thread was removed. But I've updated the style and at this moment it contains no copyrighted images.

View attachment 5480 View attachment 5481

I like your sense of humor

 

[CyberAP]

Guys, I don't understand, what are you complaining about? The style is FREE. So you don't have to pay for it, otherwise if you don't like that it was copied from Lustrous you may not to download it, it's only up to you. I will understand your complains if the style was paid but it's not.

 

[Miko]

As I said these images were copyed that's why the thread was removed. But I've updated the style and at this moment it contains no copyrighted images.


I like your sense of humor

That is why i wrote: Personally after the copyrighted images were removed I didn't have a problem with the skin.

I'm sure you didn't intend to cause any problem with ForumThemes or any other designers/coders on XenForo Community.

I'm sure you were just exited as most us are about playing and styling your new toy.

Guys, I don't understand, what are you complaining about? The style is FREE. So you don't have to pay for it, otherwise if you don't like that it was copied from Lustrous you may not to download it, it's only up to you. I will understand your complains if the style was paid but it's not.

Some of us make a living out of designing and coding and things like this can trigger lot of emotions.
Even if it's free if could take away potential buyer from purchasing the Lustros skin.

Imagine if William from ForumThemes was planning of converting his skin to xenforo and sell it...


I'm happy to give you the benefit of the doubt and move along, but I will keep my avatar for a couple of days and expect to see a full original skin released by you in the near future!

 

[CyberAP]

Some of us make a living out of designing and coding and things like this can trigger lot of emotions.
Even if it's free if could take away potential buyer from purchasing the Lustros skin.

Imagine if William from ForumThemes was planning of converting his skin to xenforo and sell it...


I'm happy to give you the benefit of the doubt and move along, but I will keep my avatar for a couple of days and expect to see a full original skin released by you in the near future!

I just showed how it's simple to create own nice-looking styles using the styles from vBulletin. If FT want to create their own style Lustrous they of course can do it, but it will be paid. My style is free and uses NO COPYRIGHTED MATERIAL. Their style of course will include some icons and a psd. I also want to say that the logo was created from the blank and uses different effects form the original one so it has no copyright of FT.

 

[Andrew]

Atleast you guys were tottaly ripped off.

I owned a website that sold about 15 skins and icons and other products. Some ******* BOUGHT EVERYTHING and then did a PAYPAL CHARGEBACK and said their credit card was stolen.........

This person stole $650 worth of art and years of practice and programming on my end. I called paypal and they said they couldnt do anything about it.

Next thing I know all my skins were appearing on pirate websites and there wasn't **** i could do.

Sorry if I cussed but everything I had been working up to was ripped in less than 5 minutes.

 

[John]

I assure you Andrew, you aren't the only one to have something like that happen to you

 

[Peggy]

Wow Andrew, I'm really sorry that something like that happened to you.

 

[Elizabeth]

Atleast you guys were tottaly ripped off.

I owned a website that sold about 15 skins and icons and other products. Some ******* BOUGHT EVERYTHING and then did a PAYPAL CHARGEBACK and said their credit card was stolen.........

This person stole $650 worth of art and years of practice and programming on my end. I called paypal and they said they couldnt do anything about it.

Next thing I know all my skins were appearing on pirate websites and there wasn't **** i could do.

Sorry if I cussed but everything I had been working up to was ripped in less than 5 minutes.

I'm surprised you didn't file a DMCA Notice to the owner of the site.